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The culture of exercising good public manners is learned so to be fair, the elderly you speak of are part of a generation that were constantly living in fear from having to flee WAR CRIME ATROCITIES committed by Japanese lmperialism followed by ATROCITIES committed by Chairman Mao and ATROCITIES committed by Li Peng. They did not grow up in an era where etiquette takes priority. Learning etiquette and public manners thrives in times of peace but disappears in times of instability. Showing good and proper manners was a dead giveaway that you were a member of the bourgeois or merchant class which could mean execution, hard labor camp, or re-education camp. Pol Pot in Cambodia gave a death sentence to a million ethnic Chinese mostly Chiu Chow & Cantonese because the palms of their hands were too soft based on the fact that there were no signs of callus which comes from hard labor of the under priveledged class. 2 million Cambodians of which half were ethnic-Chinese were murdered by the Khmer Rouge supported by Red China. Besides the genocide in Cambodia, Vietnam was engaged in Chinese ethnic cleansing triggering about a millions Chiu Chow & Cantonese to abandon their wealth to become boat people refugees so holding the door could mean missing that boat that was probably going to sink anyway or be raided by pirates and being thrown overboard after being raped. Again these were not times of stability to teach or learn public manners.
Showing politeness during times of crisis could mean not getting out alive for this generation. I would give these elderly Chinese people the compassion and benefit of the doubt for the suffering of their stories untold rather than accusing them of bad manners.
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SChinFChin
I am in New York, took a part time job post retirement at a Senior Center. Ninety percent of it's members are Chinese, and a majority of them Cantonese speaking.
All the other staff members are non Chinese, mainly Hispanic. The complaints about about Chinese members not conforming to western norms incluidng:
1. Not holding doors for others.
2. Stepping on you, shoving or bumping into you without saying "sorry" but give you a blank look.
3. Not getting to the end of the line where lines are formed, but trying to sneak in or go to the front.
4. When sitting at tables having lunch, if someone gets up and goes to the restroom, upon return, food or drinks are taken without permission.
I've been asked if that's the usual behavior of Chinese people. My only recent experience is with Chinese coffee shops with majority Chinese customers, and they also don't hold doors. The worst thing is many don't like to stand on line, and once when some guy was in a big hurry and no one let him sneak into the line decided to take his place behind the counter standling next to the cashier. I was first on line and the cashier gave him a dirty look, wanted to know why he is standing next to him, and guy said there's no room on line. The cashier shouted at the guy that he either go on line or leave. The cashier and I chuckled about it and I joked the guy must have just came from a village in China with no schools. The coffee shop is across the street for the Senior Center where I worked.
The center director ask me if people in China behave this way. I honestly don't know, I'm not born there, but usually give people lame excuses that the people we're talking about can't speak or understand English. The funny thing is in the coffee shop incident, the customer and cashier both speak Cantonese. Honestly, its a little embarrassing for me.
And I am curious if people in China behave this way, or only in America. I see it's common in HK.